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Poster: William Tell Date: Dec 20, 2011 6:35am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Same old theme...partially DEAD

All dead some of you old regulars will say...("why does Tell bother with this prattle?").

To begin, my apologies to those here who love/like Bob Seger; always hated his work. In the 70s it represented that sound that seemed so counter to the DEAD we couldn't accept it (you know the refrain by now--too pop, too successful, too far from the DEAD biz model even...whatever). But, I just finished a long read on his "geezer circuit" activities, and his closing interview response brought him up a notch in my book (so did his life's story: had no idea he started in 61!? I have some measure of at least respect for the guy now...again, sorry--just my own bias).

What was it he said? "Early is best, by far".

That's it. He also said, "Bob Dylan agrees with me".

So, I take this as more data in supporting my ongoing diatribe: early work by a band/individual is generally best, and it's all down hill after that...although in this case it was his late 20s/early 30s.

I know, I know--you all have exceptions to re-count for me, but I found it interesting nonetheless that someone I so discounted all these yrs would admit that "yes, the geezer circuit fundamentally works because all of us 'on it' realize that we have to exploit our early--our best--work".

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Poster: bluedevil Date: Dec 20, 2011 11:36am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

Tom Petty and The Heartbreakers (including recent Mudcrutch reunion) are making the best music of their careers right now. They've given up on (or are not being forced to by the biz) the 3 minute radio friendly single and are playing longer more improvisational material.

Glad to know that Miles should have hung it up after Kind of Blue. Always suspected he did nothing of worth after that.

Buckminster Fuller should have retired at 40.

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Poster: Arbuthnot Date: Dec 20, 2011 12:43pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

well, BD, you've got an ear for great music, and have suggested some gems, but with all due respect, 'Mojo' has to be one of the worst LPs i've heard in the past decade (not as bad as the Stooges 'Weirdness' which takes the cake as the worst LP of all time by a band that should have known better); now, i haven't checked out any TP&TH live shows in a good many years, so maybe he still brings it live, and it would not surprise me if he still does (he being that sort of musician), but 'Mojo' no way...

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Poster: bluedevil Date: Dec 20, 2011 12:52pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

at least he's drinking from the right well....

Live Mojo was great, but I'm mostly turned on by the Mudcrutch work (even if it is covers here; crystal river with mike and benmont is the best keith/jer reincarnation out there)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YbQwaKtPvqw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWD-0trigeg

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Poster: Arbuthnot Date: Dec 20, 2011 6:56pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

very cool covers, gracias
another thing, no one in sight will be blowing MC off the stage anytime soon, that's for sure

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Poster: RBNW....new and improved! Date: Dec 20, 2011 10:00am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

i believe the song Turn the Page just might be my least favorite song of all time....i get nausea every time i am subjected to hearing it!!

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Poster: johnnyonthespot Date: Dec 20, 2011 11:17am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

" i believe the song Turn the Page just might be my least favorite song of all time"

Mine would be anything by Foreigner. I mean come one

" Urgent Urgent do it fast do it quick Urgent Urgent Urgent Emergency!"

" Hot Blooded check it and see I got a fever of 103"

I mean COME ON! Turn the Page is a friggin masterpeice compared to that shit

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Poster: Arbuthnot Date: Dec 20, 2011 7:03am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

WT, i too am an 'early' advocat and no matter the band/artist, 99% of the time go to the early years for my fix; however, i just saw Savoy Brown a few nites ago, and not only did they put on a smokin' show, the new LP 'Voodoo Moon' is up there with the best releases Kim/SB has released to date

who's Bob Seger?

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Poster: unclejohn52 Date: Dec 20, 2011 7:28am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Who's Bob Seger?

Not sure if you're being facetious... I'm not a big fan, but his songs are part of the soundtrack of my midwestern youth. Bob Seger was a hometown hero (Detroit) who was a big favorite with the working class and factory worker, but took a long time to develop a national following. Very mainstream, danceable stuff, sung with a gravelly gruff voice. Some tunes that might jog your memory - Ramblin Gambling Man, Beautiful Loser, Turn the Page, Old Time Rock 'n Roll, Hollywood Nights, Night Moves, and the one you'd recognize from Chevy truck commercials, Like a Rock. He also co-wrote some songs with the Eagles. His music is still played in jukebox dance hall taverns across the Midwest.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V6JUS3i5Rrw

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Poster: mcglone Date: Dec 20, 2011 11:13am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Who's Bob Seger?

one of the first tunes i learned to play on guitar was night moves. when i was a kid, the pause after the line 'with autumn closing in...' just stopped me. then those clean simple chords that followed... i know it's cheese, but it's the only song of seger that ever stirred me.

This post was modified by mcglone on 2011-12-20 19:13:45

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Poster: William Tell Date: Dec 20, 2011 8:39pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Who's Bob Seger?

Yeah, sort of a guilty pleasure thing, no pun intended. That was THE song that so disturbed all us DEAD heads though, hands down.

;)

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Poster: rdenirojb87 Date: Dec 20, 2011 8:54am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Who's Bob Seger?

I'm 100% certain Arb was indeed being facetious. His music knowledge is quite comprehensive. I've always enjoyed Seger too. It's fun music. I don't care if something is mainstream. If it sounds good to me, that's all I need to know.

This post was modified by rdenirojb87 on 2011-12-20 16:54:00

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Poster: leftwinger57 Date: Dec 20, 2011 2:43pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Who's Bob Seger?

even though I never saw them I did consider the Silver Bullet Band as one of the hardest working tight nit groups.Turn the Page has a great story as lyrics and is a classic , even Metallica covered the song.

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Poster: micah6vs8 Date: Dec 20, 2011 8:01am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

Arb- I think Bob Seger is the son of the Haggar Pants founder. Seger/Haggar. His father didn't want to use their real name, because the Seger family were once a horrible bunch of Vikings.

Just a guess.

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Poster: billydlions Date: Dec 20, 2011 3:16pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

Hey WT-

What say you about the Beatles? I've always thought Abbey Road is their best stuff.

My friend is currently drumming for Bob Seger but since they play his music CONSTANTLY on the radio I just cant listen to him.

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Poster: William Tell Date: Dec 20, 2011 8:36pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

I actually take 65-67 as their peak, but I do concede the pt is arguable with them. And, I'd waffle further by accepting it can take a few yrs...so, I'd argue lifetime, ie, 20-30 yrs and then we'd all agree post-Beatles they went down hill since my focus is on the individual, more or less.

It's just the general notion that you do your best work in your 20s, give or take a few yrs.

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Poster: sjanderson82 Date: Dec 20, 2011 12:18pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

of course a bunch of out-of-touch geezers who only listen to the dead + garbage wouldn't know anything or make an attempt to listen to some of his late 60's output which is sick as fuckin' death. try out the LP "ramblin gamblin man". so dope. everything else afterwards is dad rock. if you can't dig on 2+2=? i can't help you.

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Poster: micah6vs8 Date: Dec 20, 2011 7:40am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

Early is best for many bands but you could argue all the following have the same quality or better in their later careers.

Al Anderson
Alison Krauss
Duke Ellington
John Coltrane
The Kinks
Los Lobos
Max Creek
Miles Davis
Pink Floyd
Rosanne Cash
Steely Dan
Talking Heads
Tom Waits
Willie Nelson

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Poster: William Tell Date: Dec 20, 2011 8:40pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

With those, I'd pick THeads and Kinks, and defn PinkF as peaking in the first four yrs for sure...but I know others might not say so for Pink...if you don't have Syd, you don't have much, IMHO.

And I do agree there are exceptions to the rule. But, as they say, that proves it...

;)

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Poster: RBNW....new and improved! Date: Dec 20, 2011 9:59am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

max creek ???? arent they a bob segar cover band?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Poster: micah6vs8 Date: Dec 20, 2011 10:24am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

I'm seeing them tomorrow night @ The Arch St. Tavern and am super excited. I am so blown away by how much better they are from when I saw them in the '80's. Especially Scott.

May I direct you to one of their first California dates. This one from the Great American Music Hall. Set 2, Love Will Make You Lose Your Mind (begins @ 1:35). Crank that sucker!

http://www.archive.org/details/mc1997-03-22.shnf

E- Feelin' Alright kicks ass as well.

This post was modified by micah6vs8 on 2011-12-20 18:24:25

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Poster: high flow Date: Dec 20, 2011 10:25am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

Willie doesn't sing anymore. He seems to talk the lyrics which I don't enjoy.

Very few things get better with age.

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Poster: micah6vs8 Date: Dec 20, 2011 10:44am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

True, but compare when he was in Nashville trying to fit into that world and then going to Austin and becoming the Red Headed Stranger, which was miles better then anything he did before.

These days you are right hf. His vocals during his relatively recent project with Wynton Marsalis (in which he did not play Trigger) were tough to listen to, especially his duet with Norah Jones. When I saw him a year-ish ago his singing was very thin. Still one hell of a showman and entertainer.

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Poster: high flow Date: Dec 20, 2011 10:57am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

Agreed. It's tricky because we're talking about getting better with age and there is a tipping point. An artist might peak at age 40, which means he/she is "better" than he/she was at age 30. So yes, better with age....to a point.....then worse.

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Poster: Hal R Date: Dec 20, 2011 11:25pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

Warren Haynes and Beethoven

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Poster: ColdRain108 Date: Dec 20, 2011 8:58am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

The Beatles?

I wanna Hold Your Hand or Across the Universe? Which is it?

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Poster: rdenirojb87 Date: Dec 20, 2011 9:09am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

I don't see how anyone could argue with that. The Beatles is probably THE best example of a band maturing and getting better over time.

I think the same can be said about the Beach Boys.

I also say Zappa got better as he aged a little.

Jeff Beck has remained very consistent through a huge span of time.

David Bowie arguably got better.

This post was modified by rdenirojb87 on 2011-12-20 17:09:37

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Poster: William Tell Date: Dec 20, 2011 8:42pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

As I mentioned above, I think you can argue the pt with them; in the 70s, we were all much more impressed with the mid pt of their career, but I can see the attraction of the last few yrs (ie, I put 65-67 as their best stuff). However, as Flow indicates, taking the life time of all members, it's hands down "early" (the Beatles) is by far the best, right?

IE, post age 30 or so, the fab four decline.

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Poster: chris in long beach Date: Dec 20, 2011 9:12pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

Ya know,I'm not sure if this is an age thing, or if it's that you get attached to a band because of the early albums, and then, when the band changes sound, you don't find it as appealing.

(This is the editorial "you", by the way.)

Or maybe it's because musicians have their entire life to make their first album, but then, in most cases, only a year or two to make each follow up.

I don't know.

However, I agree with the general idea.

I'm interested...where would you put Johnny Cash in something like this? I mean, he had his first hit in '57, but he didn't really hit his stride till the late '60's(but a lot of that is live,not recorded...). He also recorded some pretty good albums towards the end of his life.

I still think it's the curse of the early albums. People expect an act to keep cranking out similar material. Heck,it's served AC/DC well :D

But maybe not...even though they've been releasing the same album for 30 years, I doubt any fan would say the newer stuff is better than Back in Black.

Hmm, what is your window for musical greatness? How many years is it limited to?

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Poster: William Tell Date: Dec 21, 2011 6:29am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Same old theme...partially DEAD

As I blathered on about elsewhere, the exact number varies to suit my hypothesis...er, well, I'd say about 25-30; ie, it's an age related notion.

And yeah, lots of exceptions, Cash, perhaps, included? Not sure...

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